It took me a while, but I'm starting to catch up with the interviews from LWE, and a few others that I missed. I really should read up on the usability studies that both KDE and Gnome are doing. I have a preference for KDE myself, simply because I like to customize everything to my liking.
But I do think Gnome would probably be easier to use for the user who just walks straight up to a computer to use it. Operating systems are definitely application-centric, as opposed to task-centric, at the moment, and to me Gnome does this as well as anyone in my opinion. Looking at the desktops of every other OS, things don't seem to be well labeled.
Windows has a Start button, but what in the Hell does Start mean? (Yes, I know, you Start the adware and spyware infestation) Everyone's familiar with it, but it has no clear meaning in itself.
OS X isn't much better. You have the dock for applications, but aside from the mail icon, it's not easy to tell what each icon means, or what it does, unless you leave the mouse there for a while, and perhaps the text gives you a clue. When we got the new macs at work, not a single person was able to figure out which icon represented the Internet browser. Safari is a horribly vague name for an Internet browser.
KDE doesn't really seem that clear, either. You have a K button instead of a start button. People familiar with windows have no problems with that, but a user unfamiliar with windows might not fair so well. Even I forget what some of the programs do in the KDE menu, with all the cryptic names. I keep hearing such good things about Suse, though, so maybe they've cleaned up some of those things.
I actually like Gnome's labeling of the menus. It's at the top left, where us Westerners look first due to our left-to-right reading. It's labeled as Applications, and everything in the menu describes what the program is instead of giving it a cryptic name. Places is a pretty good "real world" analogy for file structure, I suppose. Given that words like hierarchy and directory don't seem to do it for people, I can't come up with anything better. And the System menu is also relatively well named.
During the Kevin Carmony interview, someone mentioned a flash tutorial when you first turn on the computer. Every desktop environment could benefit from something like that for new users. It's funny that I talk up Gnome, since I don't actually use it at the moment, but I'm starting to like the things they're doing. KDE4 might seal the deal for me as a KDE user, but Gnome just keeps looking better. Either way, it's nice to have choices. Who knows, I might go back to XFCE or fluxbox. Thank God for linux, though. After using it for so long, I can't imagine going back to Windows or OS X where I lose all the great options linux has to offer.
Usability
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Usability
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Tsuroerusu
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Re: Usability
SUSE does a lot of categorizing to the KDE menus, under Multimedia, they split it into Audio, Video and a few others.Vogateer wrote:I keep hearing such good things about Suse, though, so maybe they've cleaned up some of those things.
Even though it's not out yet, it has already sealed my deal for my primary desktop, primarily because I like the current KDE version, but also because of the amazing stuff they're doing for 4.0, if it becomes possible to use Helix as the multimedia engine for Phonon, the new KDE multimedia framework, you will have desktop-wide support for MP3 playback, AAC and whatever codec was supported.Vogateer wrote:KDE4 might seal the deal for me as a KDE user


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- mowestusa
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Re: Usability
You have a good point here. I feel I live with a family of computer newbies. My wife does not look under the Start Button for anything. She wants her programs as icons on the desktop or in the quick launch. She does not normally go poking around in the Start menu on Windows for anything. Of course, she hasn't used Windows for a 1 1/2 years now.Vogateer wrote:Windows has a Start button, but what in the Hell does Start mean? (Yes, I know, you Start the adware and spyware infestation) Everyone's familiar with it, but it has no clear meaning in itself.
Is "Firefox" a better name for a web browser than "Safari"? At least with Safari you have the idea of "going out to see things"?Vogateer wrote:OS X isn't much better. You have the dock for applications, but aside from the mail icon, it's not easy to tell what each icon means, or what it does, unless you leave the mouse there for a while, and perhaps the text gives you a clue. When we got the new macs at work, not a single person was able to figure out which icon represented the Internet browser. Safari is a horribly vague name for an Internet browser.
You make a good point about the icons, and I suppose that is why the tool tips have become so popular. However, take someone who does not read like a young child, and those icons take on meaning and usability quickly. I'll never forget seeing my daughter on the computer playing at Sesame Street.com without myself or her mother helping her. I asked her how she knew how to get to Sesame Street.com. She said, "Easy Dad, I just clicked on the picture."
Maybe children are not the best for usability studies, because their brains will just figure out the technology if exposed to it. Usability might be for the crusty old brains that have been doing things for the past 20-60 years of our lives the same way, and now we need to learn something new.
Steve
mowestusa
Tsuroeruso: I thought you'd mentioned that cleaning up of the menu under KDE with Suse. Good to hear that.
mowestusa: You're right about the name of Firefox, it doesn't convey any sort of hint about what it does to the uninformed user. Does Ubuntu label it as "Internet Browser" under the "Applications" menu in Gnome? I'd have to look at my sister's setup, since it's been a while since I used gnome. Applications still need names for those of us who want to choose which program we want, but labeling it first by the task it performs, then perhaps having a tooltip that mentions the name of the program would probably be closer to ideal.
When I work with retired ladies at the church, I have the hardest time teaching them to think in terms of "applications." They were opening documents from the file browser in old Mac OS 8, and they had absolutely no idea what application they were using when it opened up. I have to admit I had a hard time grasping that they couldn't tell the difference between Pagemaker and Word. I have such a hard time trying to either train myself to think like they do, or help them think like I do about computers, and I'm not sure which is the better course of action to take. I've completely given up trying to explain file formats. I try to compare file formats to languages, I try to explain it literally, and no matter what, I get nowhere. I'm going to try to start my own little training sessions for them, and hopefully we won't find out that I'm just a horrible teacher.
I think children are a great resource for learning about things. I've always held the belief that children are not given enough credit for being as perceptive as they are. How many times have you asked a kid a question only to receive an answer that points to some truth you weren't thinking about? It's amazing to see how their brains work well even at a young age, and you can see the logic there, sometimes it's really beautiful in its simplicity. Reminds me of the story about the truck that was caught under a bridge, and the scientists and teachers were trying to think of clever ways to get it unstuck, presumably trying to use their field of expertise to find a solution. Then a little girl asks, "why not just let the air out of the tires?" Perhaps it's an apocryphal story, but there's truth in it.
mowestusa: You're right about the name of Firefox, it doesn't convey any sort of hint about what it does to the uninformed user. Does Ubuntu label it as "Internet Browser" under the "Applications" menu in Gnome? I'd have to look at my sister's setup, since it's been a while since I used gnome. Applications still need names for those of us who want to choose which program we want, but labeling it first by the task it performs, then perhaps having a tooltip that mentions the name of the program would probably be closer to ideal.
When I work with retired ladies at the church, I have the hardest time teaching them to think in terms of "applications." They were opening documents from the file browser in old Mac OS 8, and they had absolutely no idea what application they were using when it opened up. I have to admit I had a hard time grasping that they couldn't tell the difference between Pagemaker and Word. I have such a hard time trying to either train myself to think like they do, or help them think like I do about computers, and I'm not sure which is the better course of action to take. I've completely given up trying to explain file formats. I try to compare file formats to languages, I try to explain it literally, and no matter what, I get nowhere. I'm going to try to start my own little training sessions for them, and hopefully we won't find out that I'm just a horrible teacher.
I think children are a great resource for learning about things. I've always held the belief that children are not given enough credit for being as perceptive as they are. How many times have you asked a kid a question only to receive an answer that points to some truth you weren't thinking about? It's amazing to see how their brains work well even at a young age, and you can see the logic there, sometimes it's really beautiful in its simplicity. Reminds me of the story about the truck that was caught under a bridge, and the scientists and teachers were trying to think of clever ways to get it unstuck, presumably trying to use their field of expertise to find a solution. Then a little girl asks, "why not just let the air out of the tires?" Perhaps it's an apocryphal story, but there's truth in it.
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Tsuroerusu
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Hehe, take a look at this:Vogateer wrote:Tsuroeruso: I thought you'd mentioned that cleaning up of the menu under KDE with Suse. Good to hear that.
http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/464_or/62.png
http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/464_or/63.png
http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/464_or/64.png
http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/464_or/65.png
http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/464_or/66.png
http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/464_or/67.png
http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/464_or/68.png
http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/464_or/69.png
You'll probably notice that the guy who made these screenshots like to install a crapload of stuff, if you pick KDE, SUSE only gives you RealPlayer, Kaffeine and amaroK for multimedia out of the box.


"Hatred does not cease by hatred, but only by love. This is the eternal rule."
- Siddhattha Gotama (Buddha), founder of Buddhism.