KDE and Ubuntu

spotslayer · Post by **spotslayer** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 7:38 pm

Dann if you are having so many issues with Gnome, Why don't you install the Kubuntu desktop? I thought I read that System 76 would install kubuntu on request so support should not be an issue. A very nice desktop and runs beryl great.

David

jsusanka · Post by **jsusanka** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 9:31 pm

I have to agree with dan about totem - I removed it from my pewters and installed xine and mplayer. at least in fedora you can remove it without removing the desktop.

god that totem mozilla plugin bugged the crap out of me -

snarkout · Post by **snarkout** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 10:35 pm

When I last looked at system76 (a few weeks ago) they stated point blank that they do not add or support anything besides the gnome desktop ubuntu. The guy they had on to interview said the same thing.

Tsuroerusu · Post by **Tsuroerusu** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 11:19 pm

spotslayer wrote:Dann if you are having so many issues with Gnome, Why don't you install the Kubuntu desktop?

I have been wondering about the exact same thing, however I still think Kubuntu is less than ideal, to put it nicely, compared to the KDE desktop you can get out of openSUSE, Mandriva or even PC-BSD.

jsusanka wrote:I have to agree with dan about totem - I removed it from my pewters and installed xine and mplayer.

I agree as well!
Totem is a totally non-intelligently dumbed down stinking pile of vomited goat shit!

I tried using it on Fedora and even with the Totem that uses Xine, it didn't play the sound on any DVDs I tried to play, then I opened up the official Xine GUI and gxine, both played the sound just fine.

jsusanka wrote:at least in fedora you can remove it without removing the desktop.

I think I know what you are referring to when you say "without removing the desktop, when you try and remove some of the apps that come standard on a default Ubuntu/Kubuntu installation, it will ask to remove the "ubuntu-desktop"/"kubuntu-desktop" package. This does NOT uninstall X and GNOME/KDE as some people claim, it's merely a meta package that depends on all the package that make up the default installation of Ubuntu/Kubuntu.

Vogateer · Post by **Vogateer** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 9:44 am

I'm waiting until KDE4 comes out and gets stable before I switch over, just to see what's it's like after not using it for several months. Gnome is pretty good, but I get so sick of them hiding stuff in gconf. Is this supposed to make administering a lot of Gnome desktops easier using something like Sabayon Preferences Manager, a Gnome project I haven't heard much from in several months, by the way.
[EDIT: Is Sabayon dead, from the looks of it there hasn't been much activity on their CVS or home page in ages.]

You know, I don't think I'd mind gconf at all if I could tell what in the Hell half the stuff is about. Looking at all the settings, the little info bit at the bottom is worthless and gives me no better idea of what it is than the key name. I don't think I really mind gconf as a concept of holding settings in a central place, and using XML and key:value pairs makes enough sense to me, but I don't like the execution and lack of information when I'm in gconf-editor.

My damned camera problem still pisses me off, where I accidentally chose PTP instead of USB mass storage. I made another user, and was able to select the correct setting. I thought possibly I'd be able to do a diff of the two users' directories and find the setting that needed to be changed. (My thanks go to someone here that recommended this, by the way.) Nope. Zero luck. I changed a ton of stuff, looked through all those XML files, and not one thing made a difference. Even if I actually like Gnome's layout with Applications, Places, and System, and think a lot of stuff makes sense, making something like that impossible to find—I've posted on four message forums, chatted with a couple of guys in IRC, and still found absolutely nothing—is just brutally painful.

Vogateer · Post by **Vogateer** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 9:45 am

Tsuroerusu wrote:
jsusanka wrote:at least in fedora you can remove it without removing the desktop.
I think I know what you are referring to when you say "without removing the desktop, when you try and remove some of the apps that come standard on a default Ubuntu/Kubuntu installation, it will ask to remove the "ubuntu-desktop"/"kubuntu-desktop" package. This does NOT uninstall X and GNOME/KDE as some people claim, it's merely a meta package that depends on all the package that make up the default installation of Ubuntu/Kubuntu.

Yeah, but isn't that a no-no according to devs and such. I thought that if you didn't have the *ubuntu-desktop package that dist-upgrade would break.

Tsuroerusu · Post by **Tsuroerusu** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 9:55 am

Vogateer wrote:Yeah, but isn't that a no-no according to devs and such.

I'm not too deep into the policies of Ubuntu, because I don't like brown policies, those are usually related to Dann, so I stay far away.

Vogateer wrote:I thought that if you didn't have the *ubuntu-desktop package that dist-upgrade would break.

Since ubuntu-desktop does not contain any files, I really doubt that, because dist-upgrade really just upgrades packages system-wide. What it would mean though is that you would not get all the apps and stuff that come by default, for example, say you have an NVIDIA card and Ubuntu decides to enable the driver by default (And you have not installed it already), the dist-upgrade would then not install the packages for it, as you don't have the meta package to upgrade which would then depend on the new packages.

allix · Post by **allix** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 10:35 am

Vogateer wrote: [EDIT: Is Sabayon dead, from the looks of it there hasn't been much activity on their CVS or home page in ages.]
.

They just released a new version

http://www.sabayonlinux.org/index.php?o ... 6&Itemid=2

Tsuroerusu wrote: for example, say you have an NVIDIA card and Ubuntu decides to enable the driver by default (And you have not installed it already)

According to some photos on flickr, the next release of ubuntu will have a non-free repositary with a warning so maybe the drivers will go in there..

http://www.flickr.com/photos/28313023%4 ... 466867001/

Vogateer · Post by **Vogateer** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 12:10 pm

Sorry for the misunderstanding, but I wasn't talking about Sabayon Linux, but the Sabayon Preferences Manager that's supposed to help manage multiple desktops in Gnome.

Allix, would you mind changing the second quote in your post, which actually came from Tsuroerusu? Not a big deal, but it's weird when I read something attributed me, and I don't remember saying it. Makes me think early onset Alzheimer's for a second.

Yeah, removing *ubuntu-desktop seems like more trouble than it's worth. If they change the name of a package, or the package is suddenly split or combined, I can see that causing headaches I'd just as soon avoid. If it's important to you to get rid of something, though, then you can obviously handle any sort of problems as they come, but I'd just as soon not track them down, myself.

allix · Post by **allix** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 3:15 pm

Vogateer wrote:Sorry for the misunderstanding, but I wasn't talking about Sabayon Linux, but the Sabayon Preferences Manager that's supposed to help manage multiple desktops in Gnome.

Allix, would you mind changing the second quote in your post, which actually came from Tsuroerusu? Not a big deal, but it's weird when I read something attributed me, and I don't remember saying it. Makes me think early onset Alzheimer's for a second.
.

oops sorry about that, first time ive heard of sabayon preferences manager, i tend to stay clear of gnome

Vogateer · Post by **Vogateer** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 3:34 pm

No problem

, and it doesn't appear that it was worth looking at Sabayon, unless I'm just missing something about its development. Too bad, as well, since I like seeing tools to make administrating multiple linux desktops easier.

I wish KDE would become the main linux desktop for businesses. But I suppose the fact that it's not under the LGPL will keep it from getting there. Aside from some issues with Kmail—though I was running the testing packages on Gentoo—I've thought KDE more stable, integrated, and customizable than Gnome. It does have a bit of clutter, and the aesthetics are a bit too "shiny" for my tastes, but I'd take customizable clutter and easily changeable "Fisher Price" looks over confusing, practically unchangeable options any day of the week.

Post by **Patrick** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 4:18 pm

Vogateer wrote:I wish KDE would become the main linux desktop for businesses. But I suppose the fact that it's not under the LGPL will keep it from getting there.

KDE has been released under the GPL for many years now. They have a dual license similar to what MySQL has. If you commercially develop using Qt you have to pay for a developer license.

Vogateer · Post by **Vogateer** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 5:11 pm

Right, but I thought the LGPL allowed you to develop proprietary apps without paying for the right to use GTK, which—assuming this is correct—would make developing Gnome and GTK apps more appealing for businesses.

spotslayer · Post by **spotslayer** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 8:15 pm

This link might prove to be enlightening.

http://system76.com/forums/viewtopic.ph ... ht=kubuntu

David

snarkout · Post by **snarkout** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 9:51 pm

spotslayer wrote:This link might prove to be enlightening.

http://system76.com/forums/viewtopic.ph ... ht=kubuntu

David

Nice! Somehow I missed Dann's big review of his system76. Assuming their lappys aren't plasticy crap, and that their keyboards are decent, I imagine system76 will soon the *the* linux laptop shop. I'm seriously considering saving up for one of their minis as a media center frontend.